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hideho69
11-12-2013, 10:02 AM
background
it is a 1600 ad beetle engine it has a 009 dizzy and a 34 pict 3 carb, points, condenser, leads and spark plugs all new. checked for air leeks and dose not have any
it is a bugger to start and when it dose start it will tick over nice for well about 5 min then just die and u can not start it again for at least a few hours it turns over fairly fast on the starter motor.
any ideas

Gaisa
11-12-2013, 10:10 AM
Sounds like it could be fuel related.
Firstly, check in the tank, see if there's any debris in the bottom and if there is, get it out (I found a lump of silicone in my old bug and the symptoms were more or less identical :blushing:, I had to use a mini grabber for things like that)
Then check your fuel hoses and fuel filter, then the fuel pump, and finally the carb.
Debris may have made it to the carb, and that can block the jets, which can be a pain to clean.
Its also possible that the carb's been sitting too long and any residue fuel may have turned to varnish, it'll have to be cleaned out.

jimcub
11-12-2013, 11:50 AM
I too had a piece of silicon that was stuck on the fuel pipe inside the tank, when petrol was being sucked out it shut of the fuel. Then when engine had died it slowly let fuel drain out just enough to fill carb, I got 100 yes down the road and the same happened over and over again.
cure I drained the tank took the pipe off the bottom, fuel was filtered and reused (unless it was old fuel). All the lines were renewed and an inline filter installed, end of that problem.
i was using a Nikki carb then and as it had a glass window to the fuel chamber, so I could see it happening.

Peter
11-12-2013, 12:22 PM
Taking all usual precautions, (extinguisher at ready etc,)
Run a pipe to a 1L+ petrol container up to the pump inlet and run, if the problem goes away it's in the fuel line/tank (breather?, no air in = no fuel out),
If it doesn't change the problem is obviously the pump or carb.(auto choke, etc) as you will have eliminated the line and tank.
In that case hang the fuel above the carb and gravity feed directly into the carb thereby eliminating the pump. Logically isolating the root cause is 75% of the solution.

Gaisa
11-12-2013, 01:46 PM
All well and good if you plan on having the tank in the rear, I intend to put mine in the front (when I get one lol), I'd like SOME weight on the front wheels and a tank will do some of that. I vaguelly recall someone putting sheet lead weights in the front area too, which is something else I'll consider, but only if the tank isn't enough...

Hrm... nothing to say I can't put a (small) backup tank in the rear tho, use a splitter tap to switch between them (within easy reach) and I is all set. :munky:

as for storage space... what storage space!?

supernova2
11-12-2013, 04:44 PM
All well and good if you plan on having the tank in the rear, I intend to put mine in the front (when I get one lol), I'd like SOME weight on the front wheels and a tank will do some of that. I vaguelly recall someone putting sheet lead weights in the front area too, which is something else I'll consider, but only if the tank isn't enough...

Hrm... nothing to say I can't put a (small) backup tank in the rear tho, use a splitter tap to switch between them (within easy reach) and I is all set. :munky:

as for storage space... what storage space!? i have my tank in the front. i have also fitted some strenthing bars from the body to the front axel beam it also helps stop stress cracks on the front wings.

Alzax3
11-12-2013, 06:51 PM
Don't overlook the other common cause of ill running - ignition. Could be coil falls over when it gets hot or other 'interesting' problem - my car was a complete piglet for quite a while until its particular ignition woes were ironed out, and one of the Mogs started perfectly from cold had a strange distributer that somehow dead shorted when warm (had several new points, condensors, caps and rotor arms - no help but all cured by replacing the dizzy........ )

Gaisa
11-12-2013, 08:06 PM
i have my tank in the front. i have also fitted some strenthing bars from the body to the front axel beam it also helps stop stress cracks on the front wings.

Thanks for the tip Malcolm. Will keep that in mind.:notworthy:

Gaisa
11-12-2013, 08:08 PM
Don't overlook the other common cause of ill running - ignition. Could be coil falls over when it gets hot or other 'interesting' problem - my car was a complete piglet for quite a while until its particular ignition woes were ironed out, and one of the Mogs started perfectly from cold had a strange distributer that somehow dead shorted when warm (had several new points, condensors, caps and rotor arms - no help but all cured by replacing the dizzy........ )

Point!. Good point.

hideho69
12-12-2013, 02:21 PM
well went to basics
checked valve gaps and reset.
checked points.
checked spark plug gap and reset.
set static timing.
set carb to baseline,
auto choke set,

strarted off the key played with carb and run on tick over and reves really well,
turned ignition off and tried to start it again and would not start, let it cool down for couple of hours and started off the key again.

next job think get a rebuild kit for carb and nab a coil from somewhere to try that,
cheepest first i think

Gaisa
12-12-2013, 03:20 PM
Perhaps you should think of what we suggested first, my original suggestion of debris in the tank is one of the first things I check these days, because its the easiest to check and easiest to rectify.
And don't forget Peter's tip of gravity feeding straight to the carb to see if it eliminates the problem

Peter
12-12-2013, 04:33 PM
Sounds like the auto choke. what ever you do when the engine is HOT do NOT touch the throttle if it has been switched off for a couple of minuets as the choke 'coil' will have cooled and will shut and there you are, hot engine , choke on. swap for a manual conversion.

hideho69
12-12-2013, 06:24 PM
ok will try them tomorrow

hideho69
13-12-2013, 05:37 PM
can someone tell me how to set up choke?

right had it running again sounded ok move dissy a little bit and will start off key but dies soon after of move dissy to were it keeps running and stop can not restart it.
tried all tricks and it is same so ordered new bog standard vac dissy to get rid off the 009 dizzy to see if that is it complete and only 27 quid from ebay brand new

Peter
13-12-2013, 07:14 PM
Funny, most people, including myself have binned the std vac dizzy for 009. there isn't really a suck it and see setting for the dizzy, std vac or 009. Set to #1 TDC. Take the cap off and set points to 16 thou', then with ignition on, use a test lamp and loosen the clamp and rotate until the notch in the body aligns with the line on the rotor arm, (pointing to the pulley) the points should crack (spark) at that point, (test light on), adjust points base plate until they do, bolt it up and leave it alone.

Setting up the choke/tick over, great fun if you have had ALL the screws out.. on the 31 PICT -3 at idling speed (hot) the butterfly is fully closed and the idle is adjusted by the larger balance/bypass screw only, (located just above the base gasket on the left side.. The smaller volume screw, just above the bypass screw is factory set and should not be touched, (but 2.5 turns from gently full in will do) tick over is adjusted on the bypass screw to get a smooth tick over, the throttle adjustment screw which is the long one resting on the choke quadrant is factory set and shouldn't be adjusted, if you have, then tweaking the bypass screw to get a smooth (higher) tick over and then bring it down to about 750RPM with the throttle screw. bit on one, then a bit on the other until you have a good tick over.
When COLD the choke should spring shut and as ignition voltage is applied to the bi-metal coil in the choke it opens as soon as the throttle is moved as the throttle stop screws stops the quadrant from moving until the throttle is opened.
On the choke housing you will se a set of lines at about 10 o clock looking at it straight on, these need to line up before tightening the three screws.
As it's not in a beetle as such you probable don't have the throttle positioner valve as it is normally located on the left of the engine compartment and joined to the carb by a vac tube, so unless you have that you can't adjust it, so forget it.

MicksRedNova
13-12-2013, 09:52 PM
well went to basics
checked valve gaps and reset.
checked points.
checked spark plug gap and reset.
set static timing.
set carb to baseline,
auto choke set,

strarted off the key played with carb and run on tick over and reves really well,
turned ignition off and tried to start it again and would not start, let it cool down for couple of hours and started off the key again.

next job think get a rebuild kit for carb and nab a coil from somewhere to try that,
cheepest first i think
Could be the capacitor (condenser) on the points breaking down with heat - a common problem often overlooked. Change this for a new one before dumping the 009.

Mick

Peter
14-12-2013, 08:52 AM
Also check fuel cap vent. no air in=no fuel out after a while. I doubt it is electrical though, valve clearance have been covered??, INHO it is carburettor related.

hideho69
19-12-2013, 11:44 AM
http://www.aircooledtech.com/34pict3_modification/

may have found the prob lots of info on this website

Peter
26-12-2013, 11:25 AM
If the problem is cured by that go for it, or refit an older type vac dizzy.