Phill's Nova Project finally begins

[Spacenut]

Meanwhile I have noticed there is no anti roll bar on the front. When I built my last car I included this in the build but I am wondering if because the car is so much lighter at the front should the anti roll bar be left off anyway?

Can anyone advise?

Yes. Leave the ARB off the car. Increasing the roll stiffness at the front of the car just makes more understeer. The Nova has a much lower roll centre due to the reduction in body height, so you would never achieve the designed roll anyway, and the greatly reduced mass over the front axle means that the effective roll stiffness is increased anyway, as the suspension natural resonant frequency goes up (ratio of sprung to unsprung weight).

Lauren

[Peter]

O.K. now from someone who has actually done it, on a swing chassis, I have tried no bar, standard bar and HD bar. I found that with the lower set of bars operating, (lower on sway-a-way) and the upper set rotating free (sway-a-way not locked) and a HEAVY duty roll bar it greatly IMPROVED the handling, by reducing the roll at the front the rear stays flatter with less tendency to 'cock a wheel', cornering is flat and firm. Without it it was wallowing about and rolling like a pig, dipping a front corner on braking in a bend and generally not nice with a tendency to breakaway and swap ends, less so now. Fitting a REAR bar and it had a tendency to slide more.

[bushboy]

O.K. now from someone who has actually done it, on a swing chassis, I have tried no bar, standard bar and HD bar. I found that with the lower set of bars operating, (lower on sway-a-way) and the upper set rotating free (sway-a-way not locked) and a HEAVY duty roll bar it greatly IMPROVED the handling, by reducing the roll at the front the rear stays flatter with less tendency to 'cock a wheel', cornering is flat and firm. Without it it was wallowing about and rolling like a pig, dipping a front corner on braking in a bend and generally not nice with a tendency to breakaway and swap ends, less so now. Fitting a REAR bar and it had a tendency to slide more.

Peter,
Thaat emplies that you have actually driven your car and not had it sat on a trailer all its life!!!! WOW

Bushboy

PS 41250 miles

[Spacenut]

Hi Peter - you changed more than one variable to get the results that you describe. Softening the front suspension (something most owners are loath to do) and then fitting an uprated roll bar to compensate, this is classic Lotus territory.

The standard Nova build leaves the effective spring rate at the front much higher than it needs to be, so the ARB can be ditched.

What everyone should do is uprate the spring rates at the back to stop the wallowing, especially on swing axles.

But you're right - what do I know about tuning a Beetle chassis?

Lauren

[Peter]

Peter,
Thaat emplies that you have actually driven your car and not had it sat on a trailer all its life!!!! WOW

Bushboy

PS 41250 miles

The car was on the road from April 1995 to September 1999 and was at few shows too, I drove it here for a week until banned by the Guardia Civil and once since, two years ago, when I finished the engine rebuild, banned again. so yes, I have driven it about 3K miles.
I also had an Enbasee charger and a Baja bug in that time both with front anti-roll bars as well as string of customers cars to work on.

[Peter]

Hi Peter - you changed more than one variable to get the results that you describe. Softening the front suspension (something most owners are loath to do) and then fitting an uprated roll bar to compensate, this is classic Lotus territory.

The standard Nova build leaves the effective spring rate at the front much higher than it needs to be, so the ARB can be ditched.

What everyone should do is uprate the spring rates at the back to stop the wallowing, especially on swing axles.

But you're right - what do I know about tuning a Beetle chassis?

Lauren

I have no idea what you know about tuning VW 'kippers', hopefully more than I know about satellites, all I know is what I know and have developed over the last 50 years. I do know you build a mean chassis though and there are as many chassis designs as there are chassis builders and you seem to have done a brilliant job on yours with a unique configuration.

Going "Lotus" ain't at all that bad, considering their pedigree and I had some help from Dave 'Winkle' Perry of Lotus (retired, known 60 years), also on my Corsa B sports chassis improvements.
The rear end did come in for a 'tweak' in as much as the tension was cranked up a notch or three and to be safe retainer bars are fitted to keep the spring plates on the beefed up frame stops. Special ball joints and dampers up front for lowered suspension and stiffer dampers at the rear with cut down buffers.

[bushboy]

Sorry Phil,
We have hijacked your thread.

Take the roll bar off is my opinion. Try it once your on the road & then put it on again for comparison.
I have coil over on mine at the front on the softest setting, just to clear the speed bumps. If I had the sway away adjusters on the front tortion tubes I could do away with the coil overs, but that is a job for another day, may be.

BAck on topic

Bushboy

[Phill]

I am discovering there are a multitude of missing parts on the floorpan assembly so don't think I'll worry too much about having to source an anti roll bar for the front - I'll just leave it off.

Finished stripping down the floor pan assembly today and was finally able to get a good look at the underside



As you can see it's looking very rusty in parts. Next job will be to go over it with a wire brush and sander to see the full extent of the corrosion and assess how much needs replaced.

The front torsion bar assembly is in excellent condition. But the brakes (discs) need a complete overhaul. Not sure of the condition of the ball joints and track rod ends yet - I will almost certainly replace the track rod ends anyway as it's so easy to do - but will examine the ball joints carefully before deciding whether or not to renew these given that they are a press fit and not something I can do myself. There are quite a few missing parts though including bleed nipples, the aforementioned anti roll bar and dust covers on the hubs as well as missing lock nuts on the track rod ends.



The trans axle itself looks to be fairly reasonable - but the boots are split and once again there are a multitude of missing parts including the castle nut on one of the hubs and a missing earthstrap between the transaxle and floorpan. These are just the things I am currently aware of - I will need to look carefully at some diagrams to assess what parts I will need.



My plan is to tackle one section at a time begining with the main floor pan

[MicksRedNova]

I remember that stage well, surprising to think that it was 10 years ago.



Mick

[Peter]

Looks like you are heading in the right direction and not too bad a condition compared to some.
The earth strap on a beetle goes around the rubber mounting on the bell housing mount from gearbox to chassis, it's the only one but another one at the front gearbox mount or the opposite side wouldn't go amiss.